Are Pirates boned without Gravitonics?

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Akalabeth
Posts: 639

Are Pirates boned without Gravitonics?

Post#1 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 7:35 am

On the subject of creating new ship lists.
Are the pirates able to be competitive without the use of gravitonic ships? I've never played the pirates, so I'm not sure how paramount it is to their typical strategy. I imagine the biggest impact would be vs towing but do a lot of pirates tow to wolfpacks? Or do they simply lie in wait for the enemy to come to them, and then rob them blind??

So question is, as a pirate, if you had cloakers but not grav cloakers could you still do well as a pirate?

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Logain
Posts: 720

Post#2 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:16 am

My experience is that grav is critical for a Pirate.

First... As you mentioned, it helps to be able to outrun a hostile enemy when you decide to "reflag" one of their vessels.

Second... When you need to get ahead of a potential hull donor, the extra speed is critical when you are involved in an off-axis pursuit. If you can't get ahead of them, it's hard to steal them... (That's the major shortcoming of today's super-quiet diesel electric submarines.)

Logain

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PaladinCyborg
Posts: 374

Post#3 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:10 am

The game would be very difficult for the Privateers, if gravatonic accelerators were taken from them. When they have a hostile neighbor, its needed so they can reach that neighbor early in the game - before his economy is working well enough to spread mine fields.

Maybe my opinion shouldn't carry much weight though, as I've only played the Privateers twice.
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B A N E
Posts: 3777

Post#4 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:13 am

Pirate w/o gravacc is crippled.
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and the truth.

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Shardin5
Posts: 3808

Post#5 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 11:36 am

I don't think anybody would even bother taking the Pirates, with out Grav engines. Speed is what the Pirate is all about. Speed in spreading out and locating everybody, and Speed of getting away with the spoils.
Lots of tactics and ship building and early starting ships, are all based off of Grav engines. Warp1 warpwell, towcapture is all based on the advantage of the Grav Engines of the Pirate. Without the Grav Engines, foes would be set to intercept there own ships, and the Pirate Rob success rate would DROP like a ROCK, and there would be TONS of Pirate ships exploding.
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hennef
Posts: 2250

Post#6 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:17 pm

I agree to everything just said. Pirates without grav engines are ludicrously irrelevant!
have fun!

hennef

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hennef
Posts: 2250

Post#7 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:20 pm

btw, you should have a look at the "VGA Planets Projects" section. I have also dreamed that dream of a more fun and more balanced shiplist.... maybe some day ;)
have fun!

hennef

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Akalabeth
Posts: 639

Post#8 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:06 pm

Well, I'm okay with the current shiplist or even T-list. Imbalances add flavour in my opinion, even if a lot of the ships are never used. I'm okay with trying new ship lists but design by committee can often end up in bland results in my opinion. Having said that, I haven't looked at your work or at least not in a long while so I don't know.


Main reason I ask is I'm fooling around with the idea of making a Babylon 5 shiplist. The obvious substitution for the Privateers is Raiders. But unlike the Orions they have no reason to have super fast ships. I suppose it would be easy enough to make up some BS excuse. Of course the whole warp drive thing doesn't mesh very well either but whatever, just pretend you're moving through hyperspace with no chance of getting lost.

I thought I might make the White Star a grav ship, give it to the AoL faction as maybe their top ship, but the Raiders can probably keep the other two ships in some modified form (the BR4/BR5 ones).

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Akalabeth
Posts: 639

Post#9 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:16 pm

My biggest problem right now is that when I'm making the ships I'm often just throwing out numbers. Weapon load-outs are fairly easy, but its hard to know what's fair overall in terms of different abilities, mass, fuel, etcetera. Suppose I should print out one of the existing ship lists and go from there.

When I have something roughly finished maybe I'll throw it up here for comment.

As for playtesting, well, dunno how to do that whatsoever. Other than playing a game, hopefully by that point any obviously imbalances would've been taken care of so the game isn't a complete waste of everyone's time.

Assuming enough people would be interested in such a beast anyway.

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Logain
Posts: 720

Post#10 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 11:11 pm

I recommend you take a look at Klauser's AQ shiplist. It's very different from the standard list and has proven well balanced in 5 different AQ games so far... I'm waiting for the next one to start.

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Akalabeth
Posts: 639

Post#11 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 11:19 pm

Yeah I got the uh, August 2005 version here. Probably a good idea to print it out then. Also have the SFB shiplist as well though it's probably a bit more generic by the very nature of SFB, but could be wrong.

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Logain
Posts: 720

Post#12 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 11:23 pm

Klauser has updated the AQ list a time or two. I think it is very similar to his SFB list.

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Akalabeth
Posts: 639

Post#13 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 11:58 pm

Hmmn, well I think I've got the recent one because I'm pretty sure he mailed it to me about a year ago or so. It's certainly got its similarities, but it's a bit different in some regards. I think overall the races have a bit more flavour, which isn't to knock his SFB list, but SFB is like that. Everyone's got a version of the same type of ship pretty much in SFB (I'm talking about the board game here).

All in all, they're both cool lists. And even cooler is the art he created to go along with 'em.

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