one quick question

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crash_harder
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one quick question

Post#1 » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:12 pm

i just finished reading 2 posts, back to back about new ideas for games... they sounded great (grudge and something else) but in both of them one of the things was "NO pirvateers or borg"....

my question is why??? why no privateers, why no borg???? if someone could explain to me why those two races would not be an option i would greatly appreciate it...

thank you
crash

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Gilgamesh
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Post#2 » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:22 pm

You are probably looking at team games where the standard 11 races leaves one race too many. In those cases it's usually either the Privs or the Borg that get eliminated.
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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crash_harder
Posts: 169

Post#3 » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:26 pm

that makes sense... you would have to can a race to make it an even #....

i didn't get the feeling that they were a "team" game though... it sounded like a one-on-one and the other one sounded normal...

thanx though

crash

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Gilgamesh
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Post#4 » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:29 pm

Which ones are you looking at?
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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B A N E
Posts: 3777

Post#5 » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:57 pm

In the grudge match? 1v1

Why no pirate:
Pirate is too easily countered by 2nd choice.
(ie: fed, liz, bird, fascist and crystal)
Pirate is too powerful as a second choice.
If player1 makes a weak vs pirate choice, game over before it starts.

Why no borg:
In the maps provided for the grudge match.

In map#1, the long distance map, a good borg will own 75% of the
map before nonborg can acquire 25%. From that point on, it is an
economic landslide generally in the borg's favor.

In map#2, the medium distance map, same problem.

In map#3, the small map is generally the best for nonborg vs borg.

In a normal game, there are 500 planets & 11 players (45/player).
In the grudge matches, 2 of the maps have 200 planets (100/player).
Map 3 is 100 planets (50/player) in a much smaller area.

HTH
Understanding is a three-edged sword.
Your side,
their side,
and the truth.

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crash_harder
Posts: 169

Post#6 » Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:02 pm

"i love it when the plan comes together"...

i get it... thank you for explaining it to me though!!

crash

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Siberian Snake
Posts: 96

Post#7 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:22 pm

Yet...
It could be interesting match-up Borgs against Privs. Myself, I'm in doubt who I would bet on. Probably Borgs will have a bit of an edge, but not much.

Siberian Snake

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Gilgamesh
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Post#8 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:25 pm

I'd give it to the Privs. They are the Borg's worst enemy and in a 1 on 1 with no chance for a Loki, a good Orion should have the borg for lunch.
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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Havok
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Post#9 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:32 pm

It would depend on the individual players skill levels too. I'd love to see an old timey Privateer taking everyone to school ass whipping. :)
Regards,
][avok

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Siberian Snake
Posts: 96

Post#10 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:45 pm

Gilgamesh wrote:I'd give it to the Privs. They are the Borg's worst enemy and in a 1 on 1 with no chance for a Loki, a good Orion should have the borg for lunch.
I meant that Borgs player is good as well. Interesting stalemate could happen: the map is covered with Borgs mines, Privs lose the mobility, and can't attack strong planets anyway.... and Borgs don't dare attack Privs planets. I would say, if Privs managed to get some Cubes before that, they are all set. But if Borgs play accurately and don't lose Cubes, they will eventually prevail. Don't forget, Privs can't clone captured FCs, but Borgs can and will clone captured MBRs. In any case that would be a real chess match with a victory likely going to the one who can predict enemy's moves better.
Siberian Snake

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Gilgamesh
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Post#11 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:58 pm

I was assuming two relatively well skilled players. I'd still give it to the Priv. I don't think the Borg could cover enough of his space with sufficient mines. Eventually the Priv would start picking off his ships.

just speculation on my part though. It would be interesting to see if anyone takes this up for real.
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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B A N E
Posts: 3777

Post#12 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 3:10 pm

Borg vs Pirate in a grudge match,

If the borg got the economy going, didn't lose cubes and got the
minefields down, then it becomes an economic grind that eventually
wears down the pirate fleet.

First thing that would happen is a planet grab rush where the Borg
should get the bulk of them, but a pirate moves 2x as fast as the
rest of the players with his GravAccs. Freighters will still move at
normal unless paired, but then that requires 2 hulls per freighter.

Figure 60/40 to 67/33 planet ratio in favor of Borg by ~turn 20.

If the borg stonewalls on the builds by building ships that do not
help the pirate, then it becomes a war of pirate ships versus borg
planets and that is an ugly battle for the pirate the longer it plays.

Borg can get away with building things like mk7 or mk8 quietus in
droves just to ensure that the pirate doesn't get a cube. The bulk
of borg money going into minefields to secure for the long term?

Early Borg Strategy:
B200, MDSF & Quietus.
B200's jump out and colonize the 350 LY range and move out.
B200's jump out and colonize the 350 LY range moving back to HW.
MDSF moves outward toward 350 LY range.
Quietus follows laying minefields.

Yuck!

In such a situation, the Borg could play a nasty turtle that would
cost the pirate dearly to invade. VGAP in the end is won via owning
the geography and against a lone thorny borg player that refuses to
build cubes it would be a very long drawn out match.

In that situation, I'd favor the Borg.
Understanding is a three-edged sword.
Your side,
their side,
and the truth.

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Gilgamesh
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Post#13 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 3:43 pm

Seems like the concensus of some very esteemed players is against my view, which is probably why I suck at playing both the Borg and the Pirate. I don't understand either race well enough.

But that's OK - I have my favourite, and I'm getting to know them better every time out.
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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Burnerboy
Posts: 412

Post#14 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:01 pm

Havok wrote:It would depend on the individual players skill levels too. I'd love to see an old timey Privateer taking everyone to school ass whipping. :)

Merlyn comes to mind.

Ron

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Siberian Snake
Posts: 96

Post#15 » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:02 pm

To be honest, I'm not sure I would like to play such a game myself. It would be a very painstaking, very long, tiring game... waiting for small mistakes...
Actually, I didn't like play Borgs much for this very reason: very painstaking, time-consuming process, with every mistake costly.

Siberian Snake

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