Klingon Question

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Shardin5
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Klingon Question

Post#1 » Tue Jun 15, 2010 1:12 pm

Question about Pillage, and Not using PE.
How many fellow Klingon Players, when a ION storm or fighting a Loki equiped Race, prevents D7 Scouting, set thier Vicky's and Illwinds to Pillage and No PE avoid hitting a planet with a SB and having to fight the SB, when invading another Race?

Reason I ask, as with no PE and No Kill mission have little control over left or Right side combat, and was looking to see if other Klingon's, avoid the PE/Kill mission or just suck it up and fight all ships and planets, when a ION Storm and Loki's are involved.
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Gilgamesh
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Post#2 » Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:27 pm

I'm not sure I fully understand your scenario, but I have pillaged with an Ill-Wind in the early turns of a game. It frees up the cloakers to go find other targets, and it is enough of a presence to pillage the homeworld while being able to fight off most of the opposition they may be able to throw at you. It also carries more clans for the eventual ground pound. The ion storm and loki thing didn't really play a part in any of those times, as I recall.
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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Shardin5
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Post#3 » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:18 pm

No the question is, and sorry for the confusion.

As the Klingon, when you can't cloak scout ahead of your invasion force, do to ION Storm, or fighting a Loki equipped Opponent. Do you give up on trying to get any VCR left/right advantage, to avoid running having to fight a SB, and just use PE=none and Mission to anything other than Kill.


Currently and in the past, while invading, and I can't pre scout a planet for what ships it may have or if the planet has a SB. I have don't even try to be the initiator and Agressor, and end up letting the oppenent set the battlevalue, and I just set my Battle order.

Now battlevalue doesn't mean as much in a torper vs torper battle, but unless you are fighting the Birds every other race has a carrier that can fight, and was wondering how many Klingon's or how often a Klingon player will let the opponent set the battle value.
Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
The US Marines don't have that problem.
President Ronald Reagan

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Klauser
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Post#4 » Tue Jun 15, 2010 10:05 pm

Shardin5 wrote: ....

As the Klingon, when you can't cloak scout ahead of your invasion force, do to ION Storm, or fighting a Loki equipped Opponent. Do you give up on trying to get any VCR left/right advantage, to avoid running having to fight a SB, and just use PE=none and Mission to anything other than Kill.

Currently and in the past, while invading, and I can't pre scout a planet for what ships it may have or if the planet has a SB. I have don't even try to be the initiator and Agressor, and end up letting the oppenent set the battlevalue, and I just set my Battle order.

Now battlevalue doesn't mean as much in a torper vs torper battle, but unless you are fighting the Birds every other race has a carrier that can fight, and was wondering how many Klingon's or how often a Klingon player will let the opponent set the battle value.
To me, that's part of the "art" of playing the Fascists/Klingons in VGAP. If I'm fairly confident I'm not going to hit a neighbor's major combattant - especially in the early game - then I'll take more chances with "blind" pillaging. Under other circumstances, I'm more cautious with my FC settings.
Klauser

"Any ship can be a minesweeper ... once!"

Gavan
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Post#5 » Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:19 am

Shardin5 wrote:No the question is, and sorry for the confusion.

As the Klingon, when you can't cloak scout ahead of your invasion force, do to ION Storm, or fighting a Loki equipped Opponent. Do you give up on trying to get any VCR left/right advantage, to avoid running having to fight a SB, and just use PE=none and Mission to anything other than Kill.
A loki using enemy can be at least checked for on each planet before sending in a cloaked ship while there is not much you can do about an ion storm unless you make a ship trade with the birds. If you send in a cloaked ship to 4 lys from the planet and then move into the warp well the next turn if your enemy has a loki you will be decloaked but safe in the warpwell and if they do not have a loki over that planet then you can move in a cloaked ship to the planet with only a small risk that a loki will arrive over that planet the following turn.
Just cause I am paranoid does not mean they are not out to get me.

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Shardin5
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Post#6 » Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:00 am

Actually I am really enjoying using Pillage mission more in mid to late game, and just setting my FC order for battle order. Current game is more midgame, now an the invasion is in full on press mode. I use Pillage alot early game, but in an invasion mode, really finding it VERY useful to have No PE, and Missions set to Minesweep and Pillage. Granted I did relearn the lesson of having one ship set to PE and the 2nd or 3rd ship set to pillage. You lose the darn planet. Stranding a SB, and stealing all its money, is really working out. My trailing Little Pests sit over the planet, pillaging away, to keep the SB down.

I will have to see how this works when fighting a Carrier Race.
Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
The US Marines don't have that problem.
President Ronald Reagan

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Samuelt86
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Post#7 » Wed Jun 16, 2010 5:09 pm

Carrier races are but toothless targs. Their ships fall easily to the determined "pop" ships and Victorious Battleships in glorious battle.

After pillaging the enemy colonist to a more managable level. A freighter can land and dump its colonist. The fully intact starbase is then yours.

Wish you could see the NF60 game. It is glorious - with battles worthy of Sto-Vo-Kor.

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Gilgamesh
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Post#8 » Wed Jun 16, 2010 5:39 pm

Samuelt86 wrote:
After pillaging the enemy colonist to a more managable level. A freighter can land and dump its colonist. The fully intact starbase is then yours.
Just did this to the Maquis in AQ5. One homeworld down! :twisted:
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Shardin5
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Post#9 » Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:48 pm

Normally,
I would be using Kill or Minesweep, and setting PE in a all out invasion, on my Combat ships, to give myself the best battle value for left and right combat. Using my Scouts or support ships for Pillage.

I am discovering that just using Minesweep/or any other mission except Kill, on my invasion ships, with 1 Ship set to Pillage in the Fleet, with no PE on ANY Ship, giving up trying to get the best Battlevalue, is actually MUCH better, as the Klingon. Has to be depressing for my enemy to see a Little Pest keeping his SB useless, and softening up the SB for capture.

Over the years, I have worried about getting the best Battlevalue, just discovering that with the Klingon, its not as important, vs Torp races.

Will see just how important or what it costs vs a couple of Carrier Races, both with poppers and without.
Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
The US Marines don't have that problem.
President Ronald Reagan

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Gilgamesh
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Post#10 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:55 am

You have to be careful here if you have killers and pillagers in the same fleet. Your ship set to kill kills the planet, and then your ship sent to pillage (happens after combat) pillages your one clan on the defeated planet and you don't have easy access to beam up the fuel on the surface to continue the advance.

Also, if you are towing poppers that are on kill/trg to take out cloakers, make sure your popper is not going to fight first. I have lost poppers that way. I usually try to pair up a lower ship number Vicki with a higher number Nefarious so I can do pretty much what I want with the FCs.
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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Shardin5
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Post#11 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:27 am

Gilgamesh wrote:You have to be careful here if you have killers and pillagers in the same fleet. Your ship set to kill kills the planet, and then your ship sent to pillage (happens after combat) pillages your one clan on the defeated planet and you don't have easy access to beam up the fuel on the surface to continue the advance.

Also, if you are towing poppers that are on kill/trg to take out cloakers, make sure your popper is not going to fight first. I have lost poppers that way. I usually try to pair up a lower ship number Vicki with a higher number Nefarious so I can do pretty much what I want with the FCs.
I am actually NOT using any Attacking ship with the Kill Mission, in an advancing fleet.
As the Klingon, I am finding to many benefits in avoiding the Kill Mission, with actual fighting ships.

Only reason, I started this thread was to spawn some ideas. As the Raceguides are pretty useless. Trying to get and share more Klingon Tactics.

I had somebody recently email me about playing the Tholians, as the Raceguides had him confused. I still don't know the players name, and have no idea what Romulan he has now abused, but he was using a race guide that was pretty useless and just a few emails, helped turn things around for him.
Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
The US Marines don't have that problem.
President Ronald Reagan

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Gilgamesh
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Post#12 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:36 am

The current raceguides are OK to a point, but you pass that point fairly quickly. Some are outdated, some are useless, and others are just wrong.

Klauser and I were talking about putting together an updated Klingon battle manual but we haven't really got off the ground with it yet.
QI'DaS tuQ SoSlI'

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Shardin5
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Post#13 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:39 am

Gilgamesh wrote:The current raceguides are OK to a point, but you pass that point fairly quickly. Some are outdated, some are useless, and others are just wrong.

Klauser and I were talking about putting together an updated Klingon battle manual but we haven't really got off the ground with it yet.
Send me your ideas, I will see get the ball rolling on it.
Klingon's are one of the least understood Races, and one of the reasons alot of people fail with them.
Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
The US Marines don't have that problem.
President Ronald Reagan

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Klauser
Posts: 991

Post#14 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 7:34 am

Gilgamesh wrote:The current raceguides are OK to a point, but you pass that point fairly quickly. Some are outdated, some are useless, and others are just wrong.

Klauser and I were talking about putting together an updated Klingon battle manual but we haven't really got off the ground with it yet.
And in fairness to you, Gil - the fault is all mine on not getting that moving. I have been tied up with family issues over the last 6-8 months, and my VGAP time has suffered.

If you want to work with Shardin instead to get the ball rolling on the Klingon guide, I completely understand.
Klauser

"Any ship can be a minesweeper ... once!"

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B A N E
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Post#15 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 8:03 am

Klingon Guide?

I'd suggest critiquing the old guides so you can cherry pick the good
from the bad.
Understanding is a three-edged sword.
Your side,
their side,
and the truth.

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